Narrator:
The sorrow of subjugation | Why did Gurudev say this to the secret seeker Shyama Khyapa? YouTube Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycIa6SLN0lU
Narrator:
This is a clean, punctuated transcript of the provided audio, translated into English. The audio features a dialogue between an interviewer and an elderly spiritual or social leader addressed as "Gurudev."
Devotee:
Gurudev, today is the 15th of August. Many events are associated with this day. Besides that, this day is celebrated on a very large scale in various parts of India - by the Navy, our Air Force, and everyone else. What would you like to say about this?
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Oh, what can I say? I have nothing to say about independence. We are, in fact, still enslaved. I see no signs of independence. I see no signs of independence at all. For this, we have to go back quite far - 74 years back. We have to see how independence actually came.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
At 12 o'clock midnight, independence was declared. On the 15th of August, 1947, at midnight, independence was declared while people were sleeping. Without telling anyone, like a theft - those who declared independence, I would call them thieves. By stealing! No other country in the world gained independence this way. We gained independence through thievery. We didn't know; we were sleeping. Even in the morning, no one knew that India would become independent today.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
So, now the point is that we are enjoying that independence - the "thief’s independence." We have become thieves ourselves. Why wouldn't we? Those who committed theft to bring independence - well, we are thieves too, in a way. I am saying this from my perspective. It is a matter of great distress. If one knows the history - the inner history - one will only feel pain. There is no point in knowing the superficial history; knowing the inner history brings pain.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
The real man, the actual person - Netaji Subhash Chandra Bose. Netaji Subhash Chandra Bose should have been the Prime Minister at that time. But Gandhiji, through trickery... he had two "sons," so to speak: Muhammad Ali Jinnah and our... Jawaharlal Nehru. These two sons. India was like his grandfather’s property - Mahatma Gandhi’s grandfather’s property. His "grandfather" had told him, "Manage India however you can. You can give it to whomever you want." So, to Muhammad Ali Jinnah - one son - and Nehru - the other son - there were two claimants.
Devotee:
Nehru.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
And the one who actually worked to make India free, who advanced towards India with an armed army - he was no one. Because India was "grandfather’s property," Gandhi divided it. He gave the property to his two grandsons. He gave Pakistan to Jinnah and Hindustan to Nehru. But the "real seed," the powerful seed - which is Kashmir, where the fire is burning or was burning - that was kept alive by Mahatma Gandhi.
Devotee:
Gurudev, at that time, when the matter of Kashmir was discussed, and when B.R. Ambedkar was drafting the entire Constitution, he was also told about the Kashmir issue. But Jawaharlal Nehru...
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Listen, there are many reasons why Ambedkar was made to write it. To get into that, I would have to say a lot. I don't want to go that far. It was never right to have Ambedkar draft the Constitution. He drafted it in his own way. And whatever advice these people gave Ambedkar, that is what became the Constitution.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
But the actual person, Netaji Subhash Chandra Bose, was deprived. He was placed in such a situation that if he were seen anywhere in India, he would be arrested. He would be arrested! And the Constitution was created accordingly. It’s a shameful incident. That is why the Nehru family came to an end.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
And the condition of Pakistan is pathetic - the same condition. If you compare India’s state and Pakistan’s state, they are the same. And he got his rightful punishment. Aghonath Biswas could not tolerate this; he shot him dead. And he did the right thing. If those kinds of people remained on Earth, there would have been more harm; India would have suffered more. He is called "Mahatma" (Great Soul), but he is not a great soul; he is a base soul. I don’t think he was a Mahatma, but a base soul. Because dividing India in that manner at that time - no one accepted it. But no one could speak out because it was the Congress reign.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Because of that, India is in a state of disaster. Even today, it couldn't be repaired. However, the BJP came and did one thing: they extinguished the fire in Kashmir. The fire that was burning, they extinguished it. But they couldn't do anything about the Swiss Bank. They came with two agendas and were a complete failure. Although they did cool down Kashmir to a great extent, they haven't been able to break the Swiss Bank yet. This is a weakness, and there is no point in the BJP coming to power this way.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
The state the BJP is in now is like the state of a dog. The state of the BJP and the state of a dog are the same. Now, what work will they do for the country's independence? Tell me. What I see is a very bad situation. The state the TMC is in today, the BJP's state is much worse than that. A very bad state.
Devotee:
Gurudev, we keep saying "independence, independence," but the actual definition of independence is very far from people today.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Very, very far. People don't even know what it is. 80% of people don't know the matter. Those few who spoke up or wrote about it - well, they all went to jail. Barun Sengupta went to jail during Indira's time. Those who were there, they gave a shout, but they were silenced. Whoever shouted was silenced, jailed. These are very low-grade politicians. I never support their politics.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
That was Congress. Pakistan’s condition is the same. When India was one, there was much peace. No one could raise a finger against such a large India. But since India became independent, it became Hindustan and Pakistan, and later, taking Bangladesh, they formed a separate country named Bangladesh. Anyway, there is a lot of history; so much history cannot be told now.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
And the most shameful incident, as I said, is Mahatma Gandhi. India was his grandfather’s property, right? He distributed the grandfather’s property between two people. Hindustan was formed, Pakistan was formed, but no Muslims left Hindustan. This is a strange thing. Today, if you calculate, the Muslim population in Hindustan has become 30% to 40%. And I hear from various sides that in the coming days, some Muslim will rule India. Some Muslim ruler or someone new will come. This is what I am hearing.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
So, it is our misfortune. A terrible misfortune that we were born in India. Born in this country, we got independence, but what have we received? Only kicks. Kicks and more kicks. We have received nothing else. This independence has no value to us because we were born to be kicked.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
To be clear, no one came forward to change this. We thought the BJP would come and we would breathe a sigh of relief, that some change would come. Because Congress ruled India for 40-42 years. Then the BJP came; we had many hopes. We had a lot of hope that the BJP would do something, especially for the Hindus. But it turns out there's nothing of the sort. So this is our fate, the irony of fate; we have to accept it.
Devotee:
Gurudev, that was from the perspective of the country's grand history. But for today's youth, who should be chasing true independence, their definition of independence has become hoisting a flag, giving two biscuits to children, or maybe organizing a drawing competition. And even those are stopping now.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
The youth is finished because of alcohol. The youth is finished in alcohol. There are no lines at ration shops, but seeing the lines at liquor shops makes your head spin; the police have to intervene. So much preference is given to alcohol. The youth is also being destroyed. So now the elderly who are here will rule the country; the youth will not come forward because they are finished by drinking alcohol. What is left of the youth? "Eat, drink, and live" - that is the job of the youth now. Even if India goes to hell, so be it, what do I care? I will stay drunk. This is the stance. I see this in every house. Alcohol has entered every home. Because it’s a huge income for the government.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Let our society go to hell, let the youth go to hell, let education go to hell, let jobs go to hell - as long as alcohol sells, my country will run well. It’s tax-free! Anyway, let the alcohol flow so we can stay well; there’s no use agitating the youth. Put them to sleep with alcohol. This is the situation now. I am not talking about other places; I am talking about West Bengal. They have destroyed the youth. This is a plan. It is done according to a plan.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
In the future, no more youth will come forward. Those old people will rule and exploit. The youth will not come forward because they are finished. Half of them are finished by alcohol. In large colleges, alcohol is consumed outside or inside. What is left of their character? Once character is gone, everything is lost. When character is lost, everything is lost. So, their character is lost; how will they take charge of society? There is no one to take charge of society.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Now it is the victory of lies. Truth has no rights. The more lies you can tell, the more you will win. And the government will sit with cotton in its ears, Tulsi leaves on its eyes, and Ganges mud on its body. The government will have nothing to do. All incidents will happen under the government's nose, and they will say, "We know nothing." Crime has been happening for a long time; the government has covered its eyes.
Devotee:
Gurudev, even now, there are those who still think about the country beyond party politics. Some people say that the British might have done better than this.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Of course! They both exploited and ruled. But at that time, people had character. Now people have no character. This is our misfortune. And being born in this country, we only got kicked. We got kicked. That’s why we have no concern for tomorrow, the 15th of August. The government will blow its own trumpet, and the common people will remain as they were. For common people, the 15th of August has just become a holiday. Nothing else. Previously, it was called a "Red Letter Day." But today that’s gone; it doesn't matter. Previously, we saw what the 15th of August meant to people - it was a huge deal! Everyone would go out in good clothes, flags would be hoisted, this and that would happen. Now all that is gone.
Devotee:
One more thing, Gurudev. A country that gained independence from the British but has learned to embrace "slavery" with such joy—that country will forget to feel the vision or light of independence.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
That is natural. This has been done by our leaders. The leaders and ministers who are running the country have caused this downfall. Look at Congress today - it’s wiped out. CPIM is wiped out. And TMC will be wiped out in a few days; it will vanish from the world. We are humans; even we have a limit to our patience. When the awakening happens, will any of them be able to stay?
Devotee:
Even so, Gurudev, in some places at some times, the youth has been seen coming forward in social activities. Perhaps in the future, such a great injustice will occur that people will be forced to come forward.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Think about the COVID vaccine. Think about what is happening with the COVID vaccine. Something that is extremely necessary for people, something that would save people or society - there’s no such thing. It’s filled with injustice and misconduct. Health was India's main priority, the first one.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
In health, India spends 1%. Whereas America spends 11%. Our health expenditure is 1%. What will they do with 1%? Look at America; they spend 11% on health. Our unfortunate country - it was always a country of beggars and remained a country of beggars. It didn't rise. Health is just a skeleton. Our skeleton. That health is finished. Kidneys are being sold. I see in the newspapers that kidneys are being sold, eyes are being plucked out. These organs are being cut and sold. No one is paying attention to that. There’s no attention to those things.
Devotee:
Gurudev, now people know the loopholes of the law more than the fear of the Constitution or our judiciary.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
The price of the book of law is 5 rupees. The price of the book on how to break the law is 500 rupees. If you go to the market, the book of law is 5 rupees. And the book on how to break the law - the price of that is 500 rupees. This is what it has come to.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
So, don't jump around about independence. The day you truly get independence, jump then. This is not independence; it is slavery. Yes, slavery. This is not independence. No one can speak; they immediately have to go to jail. If someone speaks the truth, they have to go to jail. What kind of independence is this? Even for drawing a picture, one has to go to jail now. What kind of independence is this, tell me? No one wants this independence. At least I don't want it. I don't care if anyone else wants it or not; I don't want it.
Devotee:
Gurudev, that was from the perspective of the country's grand history. But for today's youth, who should be chasing true independence, their definition of independence has become hoisting a flag, giving two biscuits to children, or maybe organizing a drawing competition. And even those are stopping now.
Devotee:
Pronam, Gurudev.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Pronam.