Interviewer:
Gurudev, Pranam (Salutations).
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Pranam, Pranam.
Interviewer:
We have been listening to your views on spirituality and science. You say that spirituality is an advanced stage of science. The limitations that science has, spirituality does not. Science is constantly researching, trying to teach us and show us through practical means. In your long life of spiritual practice, you have kept yourself busy with Kriya Yoga and various other spiritual activities. Many people come to you to learn about these things, and you give them advice and instructions. We have even seen that when the 1000-day Maha Mrityunjaya Yajna (a spiritual ritual) was performed at your ashram in Rajpur Shantikunj, many people participated who had no prior experience with such rituals. But you took them along, taught them the methods, and involved them in the Yajna. Later, we saw them learning and performing these Kriya Yoga tasks themselves. So, I see a similarity with science here, as you, as a spiritual practitioner, are also showing the way. Could you tell us more about this Karma Yoga (yoga of action) and Kriya Yoga?
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Let me tell you one thing—emptiness. We will pass away one day; who will we leave behind? We must prepare the next generation. Not everyone is enthusiastic. Some people come to me just casually to learn. They have no idea about it. They say, "I want to learn yoga," but they don't even know what a Gurudev does. But we keep a sharp eye. We can tell who is capable and who isn't. Now, not everyone can become like me or like those who are above us. But what's the harm in trying? We want to fill the void. We want people to come toward spirituality. Just shouting about science won't help. Spirituality is deeply hidden within science. And science is intrinsically connected to spirituality. Without science, I cannot even think of God. The day science accepts that God exists, the whole world will believe. So far, scientists have been writing about it. Many have already accepted God. From Einstein onwards, there isn't anyone among the great scientists who has denied God. They have all accepted science, but they haven't explicitly written, "Yes, there is a God; I have seen Him; you should also try to find Him."
Interviewer:
Gurudev, even if they didn't call it 'God,' they spoke of a 'Supreme Power.' In our country, Jagadish Chandra Bose is a prime example.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Exactly. Jagadish Bose, and look at the Bose Institute. You saw how the origin of the universe was studied there, and what came out of it? The "God Particle" (Higgs Boson). This was the essence—that this God Particle has immense power. If it enters any metal or anyone, their power increases a thousand-fold. This was discovered and recognized by the Bose Institute, and the whole world saw it and honored him. He hadn't received that honor for a long time, but now he has. This is a matter of pride for us; he is one of our own.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
But the thing is, this materialism—the mix of the East and the West—has caused us a lot of damage. We, the people of the East, are imitating the West. The West is suffering today; they are suffering from a terrible disease. You know what it is? They used to believe in consumerism (materialism). But today, in America and Britain, the flags of ISKCON are flying. Harinam Sankirtan is happening in Russia and America. What does that tell you? They are renouncing materialism. They see that India is far more advanced in the philosophy of renunciation. People here have practiced renunciation for ages. If you look at our freedom fighters, you'll see how selfless they were. You can't deny that. India's independence came through immense sacrifice.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Now, the West is suffering and wants to move from materialism to renunciation. But some people in our country—not everyone, because 90% are unaware—don't understand divinity. They haven't received much education. They boast about being educated and advanced, but we are actually lagging. There's only one reason: we don't have good education and culture. Suppose a million students take an exam; maybe 5% will excel and move abroad (brain drain). America, Russia, and England take the best minds. The rest are left here. They won't be able to achieve anything great. They won't get good jobs. They didn't receive high-quality education. As a result, we are in a crisis. The next generation is in a severe crisis. Just as we fell into crisis by moving away from renunciation, they fell into it through materialism.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Our Eastern way of life is different. For us, a day is measured from one sunrise to the next. In the West, they start a new day at midnight. We are following that, ignoring our own traditions. This confusion is causing us a lot of harm. We are losing our spiritual masters and people who truly understand these things. Those who are left are like small fish in shallow water. They don't want to listen or learn; they just make comments without understanding. They believe only in "Eat, drink, and be merry." They don't see the dark future ahead. A section of the youth has adopted this mindset. That's why there's so much alcohol consumption. While alcohol sales are being restricted in many parts of India, it hasn't stopped in West Bengal. Because those in power see it as a source of revenue. They don't care about the next generation or the country. They think as long as they are in power, they should loot as much as possible. This has become the mindset. "Didi" (Mamata Banerjee) will be here for some time, just as the CPM was. Let's consume what we can while we're here. There's no law and order. The CPM didn't believe in spirituality either, but they had one rule: "Suck it up like a straw, and it won't hurt your ego." These people now are just grabbing everything.
Interviewer:
Gurudev, I think we've strayed a bit from our topic.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
No, it is all interconnected. What you are saying is that India's spiritual form, the teachings of the Vedas and Upanishads, and ISKCON—the West is leaning towards these because they realize that materialism cannot give them mental peace. And that's why they are slowly adopting these things. But at the same time, you are saying that in India, these practices are not being followed as they should be.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Well, it would be wrong to say they aren't followed at all. If you go to Benaras University, the Vedas are taught there. Perhaps the government doesn't give them much recognition. If someone becomes a Vedic scholar today, they won't get a government job. They'll just have the title. But look at South India. Why is it so developed? Because they still recite the Vedas daily, which we don't do here. Our state doesn't do it. Our state just believes in "Eat, drink, and be merry." They wake up and just think about how to survive and eat. But in South India, by 4:00 AM, their houses are cleaned. In every house, they light a fire and perform a small Yajna (fire ritual). Many people from West Bengal come to me and take permission, saying they want to perform a Yajna with their whole family. They even have Yajna altars (Kunda) in their homes. This is what I'm talking about. In Benaras University, proper Vedic education is being given. But it's not spreading because there are no schools or traditional learning centers (Pathshalas) for it. People think it's old-fashioned, but I say "old is gold." The peace and direction that the Vedas can give to society, this "Eat, drink, and be merry" culture cannot.
Interviewer:
But Gurudev, one thing—in the realm of scientific practice, you mentioned Einstein or Jagadish Chandra Bose. Those who are dedicated to science, even they are great practitioners (Sadhakas).
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Absolutely, they are great Sadhakas. They are no less. Take the example of APJ Abdul Kalam. What a great scientist he was! He used to read the Gita regularly. Even though he was a Muslim, he read the Gita. This is what I mean. India is progressing in science, but among the general public—as you said, 90%—this spiritual awareness is lacking. When I was performing the Maha Mrityunjaya Yajna here, 90% of the people came and asked, "What kind of Yajna is this?" That means they had no idea about the Maha Mrityunjaya Yajna. I've said this before; they had no idea. Perhaps now that we are talking about it, it is spreading. And we are speaking from experience. We performed the Maha Mrityunjaya Yajna for three years and the Nikumbhila Yajna for one year. We have many photos of these great rituals. People talk a lot on TV, but they don't actually do anything. And most importantly, they don't help people in distress. They might be businessmen talking big, but they don't teach anyone or stand by them. I am a person who sees a hundred people every day, and I care about everyone's problems. People from all over the world come to me. I think about them, but others don't.
Interviewer:
We have come a long way in our discussion. I want to ask one thing for our friends who are watching. You have gained many insights through your long spiritual practice. You mentioned that you are teaching and sharing these with the next generation. Is there any call or message you have for those who want to know more about this?
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Many people are coming, and they say the same thing—they watch the videos on YouTube constantly. They say they watch an episode every morning to hear what I have to say. They find the blend of science and spirituality very attractive. People from Canada, America, France, and Japan are calling me and saying it's very good. So, the government should also make an effort. If the government doesn't make an effort, it means their intentions are not good. They don't want to teach people. Just today, two doctors came from Cooch Behar. They said they want to open a school for Vedic studies and asked for my help. I asked them if they found a Vedic scholar who could teach. They said they are trying and asked for my blessings. They are coming again tomorrow. I told them it's a wonderful thing; it's like nectar to me that they are opening a Vedic school. So, people are coming. Awareness has increased a lot. People want it. But there is so much unrest in families, a lack of money, and high prices. Where will people go? Should they eat or pray? You can't practice spirituality on an empty stomach. That's why it's hard to balance both. But people are coming in thousands. They respect me. Someone came all the way from Assam just to touch my feet. He said he had no other work, just saw me on YouTube and wanted to meet me.
Interviewer:
Gurudev, we have heard so much from you today. Friends, I request you—Gurudev has spoken about a completely new topic today in his own unique style.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
I'll tell you one more thing. Even in the military, when they wake up in the morning, they first touch the ground and say, "Mother Earth, Mother India, I will protect you." They have to say this when they wake up. They are doing it. So why shouldn't ordinary people? If you have any questions, you can leave a message in the message center of our "Gupta Sadhak Shyama Khepa" YouTube channel. Also, provide your phone number. Gurudev will surely talk to you when he has time and try to answer your questions. Also, keep an eye on this channel for future Facebook Live sessions where Gurudev will be present to answer your questions directly.
Interviewer:
Pranam, Gurudev.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Pranam.