Interviewer:
Good evening to all our viewers. You can see Pagla Baba on the screen; many of you know him. He is sitting right next to Gurudev. We are here today for a special announcement and to share some of their thoughts. Please listen carefully; I believe what they are about to say is very important and urgent. Gurudev, my respects to you.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Blessings.
Interviewer:
Pagla Baba, my respects to you as well. It's wonderful to see you next to Gurudev after such a long time.
Pagla Baba:
It feels great to be with Gurudev as well. Today's topic is very important. Gurudev has mentioned many times, including in a recent episode, that there is a great deal of deception occurring. Our Shanti Kunj and Gurudev have always been transparent. It is a place of peace and honesty. None of us, including Gurudev and those at Shanti Kunj, ever want anyone to be deceived or mistreated. Gurudev has clearly stated, and it is even written at Shanti Kunj, that not a single penny is taken for solving people's problems. He never took money in the past, he isn't taking any now, and he won't in the future. However, Gurudev noted that there are individuals—perhaps one person or several—who are engaging in deception by taking money. Since Gurudev does not accept money, these people are now using my name to carry out these frauds. I want to say clearly and firmly: if anyone claims Gurudev doesn't work and says they can get things done through Pagla Baba for a fee, it is a complete lie.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Pagla, I have a certain influence over you. I could tell someone, "Pagla will do this for you." But I know you have your own needs—food, family, and so on. I, on the other hand, do not take a single penny for any work, no matter how significant it is. Because of that, I cannot simply ask you to do this or that work for free. It wouldn't be right. You have a family and children to support. How you manage that is your personal matter, and I will not interfere. In the future, I will never ask you to do any specific work or become dependent on you. As long as I am alive and breathing, I won't do that. I love you from my heart. I have no intention of bringing people from outside and getting work done through you.
Pagla Baba:
Exactly. You have guided us in so many ways. Where else would we seek guidance? It's always from you. There is nothing separate from you.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
You even went to Kamakhya.
Pagla Baba:
Without your blessings, I could never have reached there.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
It wasn't just my blessing; it was my wish that a disciple should walk to Kamakhya. I'm glad you did. Perhaps it received too much publicity, or some unscrupulous people got close to you.
Pagla Baba:
That is exactly the issue.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
When you needed someone to accompany you, I sent Shyamol Das. He did whatever he had to do, but he has been committing fraud. He is using your name for personal gain. People in Assam know you, from the Chief Minister on down. He took advantage of that.
Pagla Baba:
Exactly. When people come to the temple or try to contact us, they are told that Gurudev is unwell and not seeing people, but that they can get work done through Pagla Baba instead. If anyone hears this, know that it is a lie. There is no such arrangement. Firstly, anyone coming to Gurudev or Shanti Kunj will receive help directly from Gurudev, not from me—and certainly not for any price. Even if you give money, it is a waste. It won't reach me, and no work will be done. If you come for Gurudev, you should only approach him. Gurudev will eventually pass things on to the Mother Goddess. There is no point in coming to me or using my name for these things.
Interviewer:
If Gurudev wants you to do something, he will give his permission.
Pagla Baba:
He will give permission, and I won't do anything that causes him trouble. He will manage his disciples and those who come to him. I don't need to know how he supports himself. If he asks for help, I will provide it.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
If people become more aware, these things won't happen. I'm glad he made this declaration. If there's a major task, I have grown old and might expect him to help.
Pagla Baba:
Only if Gurudev recommends it, and after discussing it with him, will I get involved. Otherwise, I will not. I won't work for anyone else, especially those who come to Shanti Kunj. Don't fall into these traps or waste your money.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Recently, a lady was charged 5,000 taka for a ritual (Hom-Joggo) to bring back her husband. She was also asked for another 2,700 taka. When she came to me, I asked why she gave money without consulting me first.
Pagla Baba:
We've seen from the beginning that Gurudev never takes money. Where did the question of money even come from? It's been said repeatedly that Shanti Kunj doesn't take money.
Interviewer:
In such cases, the ones giving the money are also responsible.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
It's been said many times. If you give money, it is at your own risk. I hear about these things but often can't do anything about it. I don't even have the strength to take action. If you give money without asking me, I am not responsible.
Pagla Baba:
Gurudev never takes money for spiritual work. He might take necessary materials for rituals, but never cash. He usually uses whatever is available at the temple. I've performed many rituals here and never seen him ask for anything. Even if someone brings sweets, he tells them not to waste money and to offer them to the Goddess. There is no question of cash. Please do not give money in my name. This is my sincere request to Gurudev's followers.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
I might tell someone to go to Pagla Baba. Recently, someone said it was too far. I told them not to go then. I only send people to those I trust. Whether the work is successful or not depends on various factors; not even all doctors can cure every patient. But after 30 years of doing this, I have some confidence. I don't give people anything complicated—maybe a red cloth or a mantra, which works in 90% of cases. Only in 10% of cases, like when someone struggles to have children, do I move to more complex rituals. I don't know his disciples and don't concern myself with what they do. He does his thing, and I do mine.
Pagla Baba:
Hearing about people using our names to take money is very painful.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
You should use your talent and tell people to come to you directly.
Pagla Baba:
But Gurudev, he always says he does everything with your permission.
Interviewer:
Viewers, you need to be certain if it's really Pagla Baba you are speaking with. But first, contact Gurudev directly. If he wishes it, things will happen.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
I trust him and know he won't deceive anyone. But as I said, spiritual work might not always be successful for everyone.
Pagla Baba:
I spend my time in meditation and don't do much work for others. I only get involved if Gurudev specifically asks me to.
Interviewer:
Viewers, Pagla Baba is one of Gurudev's top disciples. You know him for his spiritual journey from the crematorium to Kamakhya. Gurudev trusts him. Please approach Gurudev first with any problems. Gurudev, is there anything else?
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
No, I've said everything clearly. I am not dependent on anyone. I do my own work. Sometimes, when I am unwell, Pagla Baba helps out. I've helped many people here—those with family members in the hospital or other major issues. I perform rituals and provide what is needed.
Interviewer:
That's all for today. Stay alert and rely on Gurudev.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
They don't have the mentality to deceive Gurudev. That's why I love him. He's been with me since he was very young, and I've never heard anything bad about him.
Pagla Baba:
We saw your tears when he left for Kamakhya. That shows your love for him.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Let him do his work. He needs to support his family. I sell my books to manage my own expenses. Yesterday, someone said they sold 1,600 taka worth of books, but there were no lentils (dal) for the Goddess's offerings. I told them to use that money to buy the lentils. I am not looking to buy cars or houses. My goal is to serve the Goddess and the people. That is what I will do as long as I live.
Interviewer:
My respects, Gurudev.
Guru Shyama Khyapa:
Blessings.