Interviewer:
Pranam, Gurudeb.
Gurudeb:
Yes, child. Pranam.
Interviewer:
Today, we want to ask you about a very important subject: Diksha (initiation). Many people come to you seeking initiation, and many call you regarding this. First, could you explain the necessity of taking initiation?
Gurudeb:
Well, there is a common saying, "Education and initiation go hand-in-hand." Initiation isn't just mentioned separately; it follows education. One must understand that if there is education, initiation will follow. Now, before initiation occurs, several symptoms or signs often appear. For example, you might be lying in bed at night and hear the sound of a conch shell ringing, making you feel as if a prayer is happening somewhere. Or perhaps you envision someone specific, and they appear before you. Or you might go somewhere and a saint suddenly grabs you and says, "Hey, it's time for your initiation. Take it."
Gurudeb:
These are some signs. However, when people come to me with these experiences, I don't just give them initiation immediately. I judge the situation first. Just now, I received a call from Ghaziabad. He said, "Shat-koti pranam (a hundred million salutations). You are my Gurudeb; please initiate me." Imagine, he is in Ghaziabad, and I am here. Perhaps he liked something he saw on YouTube. But initiation doesn't happen before its appointed time, and the Guru is often predestined.
Gurudeb:
The Guru you had in a previous life often becomes your Guru in the next. You've seen this with Shyama Charan Lahiri and Babaji. Shyama Charan used to call him "Babaji." Babaji was his Guru in a previous life. When Shyama Charan entered the cave, Babaji said, "Shyama, you've come? I've been waiting to initiate you. I was your Guru in your past life. Do you remember these things?" Shyama Charan couldn't recall anything. Babaji showed him a tiger skin he used to sit on, but he didn't recognize it. He showed him the fire pit where he performed rituals, but he still couldn't remember. Finally, the Guru touched a specific point on his body, and his past memories came rushing back. Only then did he realize that Babaji had indeed been his Guru before.
Gurudeb:
So, the Guru is destined. People search and search, and at the right time, they find their Guru. It's like finding a specific pebble that represents Narayan among many stones. One finds a Guru based on their own nature (Vriti). For instance, a thief will seek a Guru who is a master of theft. A heavy drinker will look for a Guru who can drink four bottles without wavering.
Gurudeb:
However, a true seekerāa "Sat" personāwill find a Sat-Guru (a true Guru). There are signs of a Sat-Guru. Ramakrishna used to say, "Test the Guru before accepting him." Nowadays, people see a picture and decide, "He is my Guru." They don't test anything. Most people who come are novices; they don't understand the depth of the Guru-disciple relationship. In our Tantric tradition, there are 300 pages dedicated just to the Guruāhow he should look, the structure of his hands and feet, and how a disciple should behave. Most people don't read or know these things.
Gurudeb:
Many people come to me saying they have already been initiated once but want me to be their Guru now. I tell them that is not possible. If someone has already initiated you, they are the ones who hold you. I cannot disrespect your Guru. Every Guru is great to their disciple. I tell them to give up that thought. They can come sit with me and talk, but I cannot be their Guru if they have already been initiated once. Initiation happens only once.
Gurudeb:
Sometimes people come because their Guru has passed away (Dehantar). I tell them, "Don't say the Guru has died. You might die twenty times, but the Guru does not die."
Gurudeb:
There are different methods of initiation. In the Ramakrishna Mission, for example, they might initiate 50 people at once through a microphone. But in Tantra, it is said that one should not perform a "mass" initiation. That is a personal matter, so I won't comment further on their ways. In our practice, we must sit with the person and touch their body at specific pointsāthe lotuses or chakras. We touch the Muladhara, Svadhisthana, Manipura, and so on, up to the Sahasrara, while chanting.
Gurudeb:
Before the ritual, I ask, "What do you want to be initiated into? A Shakti mantra or a Krishna mantra?" If they tell me to decide, I use the metaphor of sweets: "If you like Rasgulla, you won't be happy if I give you Danadar." We decide together which deity they have faith in. There are male deities like Shiva, Brahma, or Vishnu, and female deities like Kali, Tara, Durga, Saraswati, or Lakshmi. I don't force anything on them.
Gurudeb:
Another rule is that a mother should not watch her son's initiation. Just as a mother does not watch her son's wedding ceremony, she should not be present for his initiation. This is our Hindu tradition. We see this in the lives of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and Adi Shankaracharya. When Shankara wanted initiation, his mother refused. He used a clever trick. He went into the water and started shouting, "A crocodile has caught me! It's eating me!" The villagers gathered, and he told his mother, "If you give me permission to take initiation and become a monk, the crocodile will let me go." She was forced to give her permission, and only then did the "crocodile" release him. Chaitanya Mahaprabhu also had to seek permission while his mother was in a trance-like state or asleep.
Gurudeb:
So, I always ask, "Have you taken permission from your parents?" If they say their parents have passed away, I tell them to meditate on their faces and seek their blessing in their hearts before I proceed. This is a vital rule.
Interviewer:
Initiation is a two-way process. You spoke about the Guru, but surely the seeker also needs preparation?
Gurudeb:
Absolutely. When someone asks for initiation, I tell them, "Come to me first. Let me judge you." I have turned many people away. I won't "scatter pearls before swine." I talk to them to understand their motives. Some people come because they are in deep troubleāperhaps they are drowning in debtāand they think initiation will magically solve their worldly problems or wash away their sins.
Gurudeb:
We do not take money for initiation. Ramakrishna and Ramprasad both said that a Guru who takes money for initiation, and a disciple who pays for it, both end up in hell. We only require a haritaki (myrobalan fruit) and traditional clothing. I won't initiate someone wearing a shirt and pants; they must wear a simple cloth as per the scriptures.
Gurudeb:
The process takes timeāat least half an hour for each person. I have to recite the lineage of Gurus and the disciple's name and lineage. The disciple's eyes are tied or closed; you cannot take initiation with open eyes. I chant the mantra into both ears and make the disciple repeat it. Because of the time and energy it takes, I never initiate more than two or three people in a single day. After the initiation, I have them sit before the Mother (deity) and perform a small worship with flowers and garlands. That is the essence of the process.
Interviewer:
Gurudeb, we will end this first segment here. We have a few more questions regarding initiation for the next segment.
Interviewer:
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Gurudeb:
Pranam.