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Aghori Arniban meets Gurudev. (part-1) YouTube Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygxFeLa7cHw
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This transcript provides a translation and well-formatted record of the conversation regarding the Aghori tradition.
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Participants:
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Host: Interviewer
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Gurudev: Manas Halder (Spiritual Teacher)
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Anirban: An Aghori practitioner and disciple of Gurudev
Host:
Gurudev, Pranam.
Gurudev:
Yes, my son.
Host:
Gurudev, we see an Aghori seeker sitting beside you today. It has been a long time since we've seen him. To common people like us, there is very little knowledge about the Aghori path. I would like to ask you both about this community and your practices.
Anirban:
Namaskar. My name is Anirban. My Gurudev is Manas Halder. I have come to take refuge at his feet today after a long time. Regarding the misconceptions people have about Aghoris-that those who wear black clothes are harmful to society-we must move away from such deep-rooted prejudices.
Anirban:
The word "Aghori" essentially refers to one who does not reside in a "Ghor" (a conventional home or social structure). They live in the "Aghor"-a state beyond the ordinary. While a common man speaks to others in a certain social manner, an Aghori operates on a different motivation; they are detached from the usual "yes" or "no" of social interactions. We are all followers of Bamdev Baba, the great devotee of Mother Tara, also known as "Khepa Baba." In our tradition, "Bam" (Bamdev) comes before "Tara." If we don't remember Bamdev Baba, we cannot truly reach Mother Tara.
Host:
In that case, we see members of your community wearing black clothes. This often instills fear in common people. You've addressed that fear, but there are also rumors that you consume human remains or organs in the crematorium. Is there any truth to this?
Anirban:
Look, there are many folk tales and rumors. Crematorium rituals (Shmashan Kriya) are "Gupto Kriya"-secret rituals. These cannot always be discussed openly. There is a level of secrecy among Aghoris that no one else in the world of Tantra can truly grasp.
Gurudev:
Let me add to this. The Aghori sect is one of the ten branches of the Dasnami Sampradaya. Regarding the attire-this black clothing-one cannot simply choose to wear it. Even if I wanted to, I couldn't just wear it by choice. It must be bestowed by the Guru. When the Guru hands it to you, only then can you wear it. Their devotion to the Guru is immense. Our lineage traces back to Matsyendranath and Gorakhnath.
Gurudev:
Today, the Aghori sect is largely divided into two groups: one group consumes meat, while the other is strictly vegetarian. Since we are in Bengal, fish and meat are part of the local diet and culture, so it doesn't necessarily hinder spiritual practice. However, everything depends on the Guru's "Aadesh" (command). An Aghori does not take a single step without the Guru's instruction. If the Guru tells them to sit on a funeral pyre, they will do it.
Host:
So, the fear people have is largely unfounded?
Gurudev:
Yes, it is an irrational fear. My father was also an Aghori. Bamdev Baba was a complete Aghori. There are many secret aspects to this. For example, Baba used to wear red, but in his heart and soul, he was an Aghori. It is true that in certain high-level rituals, some practitioners may consume small amounts of human flesh or organs from a funeral pyre if the Guru commands it. This is part of the Nath Sampradaya, the highest order. It all depends on the Guru.
Anirban:
Exactly. This black dress is given by the Guru. We cannot just buy black cloth from a shop and call ourselves Aghoris. Even the black bangle I am wearing is a gift from the Guru. For us, the Guru's word is the ultimate truth (Veda Vakya).
Host:
Why specifically black clothes and black bangles?
Anirban:
It isn't just about the color black. Aghoris wear black because "Aghor" means those who are not bound by the home. There isn't necessarily a "scientific" reason; it is a "Parampara" (tradition). We follow the order of Gorakhnath Ji.
Gurudev:
In the Dasnami sect, there are different colors. The Guru provides the "Langot" (loincloth). Based on the color of that Langot, the seeker follows a path. Even though I didn't see Bamdev Baba while he was alive, I follow his instructions to the letter. These seekers are progressing well in their "Sadhana" (discipline). I always tell them: do not do anything for selfish or bad motives. Work for the well-being of people. Even if you have to perform a "Shatkarma" (a powerful tantric ritual), it should be done to help someone in an indirect way. In the Gita, Krishna says that even if someone kills their father and seeks refuge in a Guru, the Guru must protect them and take on their sins. For us, the Guru is higher than God.
Host:
I noticed that during the "Arati" (prayer ritual), Aghoris often move backward. Why is that?
Gurudev:
They are great devotees of Shiva (Shaivites). During the Arati of the Lord, they move backward because they are constantly seeking the Guru's permission and command. They never turn their back on the deity or the Guru.
Anirban:
As I said, the "Guru Aadesh" is everything. I am here today only because my Guru gave me permission to visit.
Host:
Anirban, you mentioned "Uchhishta Matangi" earlier. Could you explain what that is?
Anirban:
Mother Matangi is one of the ten Mahavidyas. She is worshipped as "Uchhishta Chandalini." The ritual is performed in a state that society might consider "impure"-for example, with an unwashed mouth or in "impure" clothing. If done with a pure heart and under the Guru's guidance, one receives her immense grace. However, without a Guru's protection, many people lose their mental balance performing these intense rituals.
Host:
Many Tantriks are known to use their powers for both good and bad. Is that true for your community as well?
Anirban:
Before performing any ritual that could be perceived as "negative" or "harmful," one must judge whether it is necessary. Bamdev Baba never wished harm on anyone. He only acted if he felt it was "Mother's will." If a Guru commands a "negative" act for a greater purpose, only then is it done. Otherwise, we do not engage in negative works.
Gurudev:
There is a saying in the Aghori line: "If you want to receive something, you must first become lowly (humble)." You must stay "down" or "beneath" to receive the Guru's grace.
Anirban:
Yes, you must be "Niche" (humble/lowly) before the Guru. He is our pathfinder. We know nothing without him.
Host:
It has been fascinating to hear your perspectives. People often fear the unknown, but hearing about your devotion to the Guru and your philosophy of peace-despite the black attire-is enlightening.
Gurudev:
Everyone has their own path. I wear white because it is what my "Mother" (the Goddess) prefers for me. If I wear red or black, she becomes upset. So, I stay in white and perform my service. It's all about what the divine and the Guru prescribe.
Host:
Gurudev, thank you for this conversation. Pranam.
Gurudev:
Bless you. Namaskar.